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(From the original e-bay thread........)
Hi Andy (69 Dirty Rat) how are you doing?
This 69 L88 is identical to mine except for the few extra miles on it (16670) and the factory side pipes (an option I simply had to have).
FWIW, a red/blk 69 L88 roadster I did'nt buy back in June 2004 recently sold by Mecum Auctions in June 2008 for $435000US.
These 69 L88's still have a way to go before they bring the same kind of money that a 1971 Ford GTHO Phase 3 brings here in Oz.
I wonder whether this late 60's early 70's muscle car craze will continue after our generation has passed on? Time will tell I guess;42
Wayne
(http://www.nswcorvettes.com.au/photo/albums/userpics/69_l88_corvette_01.jpg)
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Originally posted by RubyZR1
Hi Andy (69 Dirty Rat) how are you doing?
This 69 L88 is identical to mine except for the few extra miles on it (16670) and the factory side pipes (an option I simply had to have).
FWIW, a red/blk 69 L88 roadster I did'nt buy back in June 2004 recently sold by Mecum Auctions in June 2008 for $435000US.
These 69 L88's still have a way to go before they bring the same kind of money that a 1971 Ford GTHO Phase 3 brings here in Oz.
I wonder whether this late 60's early 70's muscle car craze will continue after our generation has passed on? Time will tell I guess;42
Wayne
An engine pic FWIW....sorry I was'nt sure how to add more than one pic to my thread.;42
(http://www.nswcorvettes.com.au/photo/albums/userpics/69_l88_corvette_07.jpg)
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I'm jealous!!!! BEAUTIFUL! I reakon the GTHO is way overpriced compared to some better US muscle cars of the same period! Believe it or not I could have bought a GTHO in the US back in 2000 for $15K yes 15K! I got no idea why it was there but according the the sign/desciption that was attached it was real (but he may have lied to sell the car???), I just didnt have any spare cash and the boom had not started here yet! I could be rich by now!
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Jealous! That cars cleaner than my house!
Very very nice ride you have there.
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both awsome cars.....pitty they dont get driven,which to me is an insult to the car.....no offence runy...sure its worth some money...but only if its for sale and finds a buyer.....,other than that its a waste to have lying around doing nothing....
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The only problem with driving it on the street means it will overheat! unless you put a fan shroud it wont drive far!
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Originally posted by 69 DIRTY RAT
I could have bought a GTHO in the US back in 2000 for $15K yes 15K! I got no idea why it was there but according the the sign/desciption that was attached it was real (but he may have lied to sell the car???), I just didnt have any spare cash and the boom had not started here yet! I could be rich by now!
well even if you bought it at that price and was not genuine, you would have till made a fortune
hey wayne have you ever had that car judged with NCRS?
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i see your point dirty rat.....its turely an awesome car, and too think its been tucked away. ive never heard of it,nor any of my vette friends....we all know about the silver L88, but this particular car looks to be in better cond...does it have any history? race car perhaps?
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Originally posted by 69 DIRTY RAT
Believe it or not I could have bought a GTHO in the US back in 2000 for $15K yes 15K! I got no idea why it was there but according the the sign/desciption that was attached it was real (but he may have lied to sell the car???),
As the saying goes, curiously today there are more XU-1s and GTHOs in existence than ever came off the Holden and Ford production lines.
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Thanks for your comments guys, esp Andy.
As you no doubt know, pics don't reveal all the "warts" meaning imperfections on a car.
This L88 was never raced, well the history I have indicates that. The documentation that accompanies this car is very comprehensive (sorry to sound like I'm pounding my chest guys). I have the original bill of sale and finance contract to the first owner, ownership transfers & titles b/n the first three owners, annual mileage declarations up until circa 1990 evidencing the 16635 mileage as shown on its speedo, Corvette Order Copy (commonly referred to as the tank sticker), Car Shipper Copy, what I believe is called the Moroney Report (which looks like a carbon copy of the Car Shipper Copy), a photo album containing many happy snaps of the first and third owners with the car, pics of the engine rebuild by the third owner completed circa 1989, its NCRS Top Flight Certificates when it was judged by the third owner back in 1989 & 1990, its Bloomington Gold "Silver" Certificate when it was judged in 1990...it did'nt make the "Gold Award" due to the poor engine re-stamping when the engine was rebuilt in 1989, and many other pics inc. one showing the remains of the original tank sticker on its fuel tank (which is still in car btw).
Unfortunatley I don't have my L88's original Protect-O-Plate that would complete the documentation set for this L88.
I have tried to communicate with its first owner, but for his own reasons he refuses to liase with me. I have spoken & emailed the third owner many times, and that's how I got the NCRS and Bloomington Gold Certificates for this L88.
My L88 was sold via Proteam Corvette in Napolean Ohio back in 1990-91, and I now have a copy of the advertisement, courtesy of Terry Michaelis.
Unfortunatley, due to strict privacy provisions in the USA I have been thwarted in "filling-in-the-gaps" of the ownership of my L88. For instance, like the first US owner, its two Canadian owners will not allow their details to be provided to me. I don't want to contact them, just record their details for future custodians of this L88.
Joe, I have not had my L88 judged by NCRS, although Murray is very keen for me to have it done.
I'm not a trophy hunter (No disrespect intended to those guys here that have, or intend having their cars judged by NCRS), however; there are some items that require attention on my L88 before I'd consider having it NCRS'd in Oz.
This L88 was repainted by its first owner in 1986 just prior to him selling it (not a body off restoration) . This car has suffered the usual vagries of BB corvettes, meaning it has small fractures in the front clip behind the headlights, the window rubbers are hard, etc.
Although only a low mileage car, the drivers seat has two rips in it, one where your right butt cheek meets the seat upon entry (my L88 does'nt have the telescoping steering wheel option unfortunately), and the second on the lower section of the seat back. I have left these "as is" because it's the cars original trim. It still has all its original factory chalk markings on the chassis.
Crickey, I've written a "war & peace"...if you've read this far I'm sorry to have bored you with my ramblings.
;42
Wayne
(http://www.nswcorvettes.com.au/photo/albums/userpics/69_l88_corvette_11.jpg)
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rubyZR1
you are the new god of this site. i had no idea that there was two L88's in oz i thought the only only was the silver 69 in qld.please give us the story on who what how and where you got this sweet car as i would love to see and hear more about it.
THE L88 IS STILL THE KING AND LONG LIVE THIS KING.
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totally agree bosche..... MORE PICS of what just about everyone wants to own,
what a machine....... more pics im starting to salivate......
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Hey RubyZR1 was that you I spoke to a few years back on Kevin Suydam's ZL-1 forum site (which doesnt exist now??)
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Originally posted by RubyZR1
Joe, I have not had my L88 judged by NCRS, although Murray is very keen for me to have it done.
I'm not a trophy hunter (No disrespect intended to those guys here that have, or intend having their cars judged by NCRS), however; there are some items that require attention on my L88 before I'd consider having it NCRS'd in Oz.
When it comes to NCRS it is not about being a trophy hunter it is different from other judging..It is about showing your pride and joy and share the information with other vettes enthusatic, because afterall it is a special car that you have.
You should brought your car at the NCRS melbourne chapter :{
by the way do you still have the original tyres?
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Wayne,
If you want a bunch of pictures posted up just e-mail them to me and I'll set up a picture galley account for you and put them up, then give you the password to the gallery so you can add more later. CLICK ME (cam@nswcorvettes.com.au) to e-mail Cam. ;42
I think the boys want to see and hear a whole lot more about this machine.
Cam
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that would be an understatment cam..... starting to get a chubby just looking at it.....
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Originally posted by 69 DIRTY RAT
Hey RubyZR1 was that you I spoke to a few years back on Kevin Suydam's ZL-1 forum site (which doesnt exist now??)
Hello Andy, I do remember Kevin Suydam's website existed some years ago. He has or had some very nice cars in his collection. Sorry Andy, I don't recall ever posting a thread on Kevin's website.
Wayne
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Originally posted by Cameron 77C3
I think the boys want to see and hear a whole lot more about this machine.
Cam
+1 ...
I'm still jealous!
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Originally posted by jolinari
Originally posted by RubyZR1
Joe, I have not had my L88 judged by NCRS, although Murray is very keen for me to have it done.
I'm not a trophy hunter (No disrespect intended to those guys here that have, or intend having their cars judged by NCRS), however; there are some items that require attention on my L88 before I'd consider having it NCRS'd in Oz.
When it comes to NCRS it is not about being a trophy hunter it is different from other judging..It is about showing your pride and joy and share the information with other vettes enthusatic, because afterall it is a special car that you have.
You should brought your car at the NCRS melbourne chapter :{
by the way do you still have the original tyres?
Joe, I owe all here an apoligy for my poor choice of words in the above post.
The reason why I did'nt have my car NCRS Flight Judged at Sandown in Melbourne 2006, is because I am just plain lazy.
As previously stated, my car requires quite a few little odds and ends.
Although I did state I am not a trophy hunter, I believe if I am to submit it for Flight Judging by the NCRS I should present it as best as I am able....I guess I just contradicted myself Joe;-)
My car does not have its original tyres Joe. That's one of the "little odds and ends" I was referring to above.
FWIW Joe, it was me that had breakfast with you on the saturday morning prior to the NCRS festivities kicking off.
Do you still have your lovely red roadster?
Wayne;42
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Originally posted by Cameron 77C3
Wayne,
If you want a bunch of pictures posted up just e-mail them to me and I'll set up a picture galley account for you and put them up, then give you the password to the gallery so you can add more later. CLICK ME (cam@nswcorvettes.com.au) to e-mail Cam. ;42
I think the boys want to see and hear a whole lot more about this machine.
Cam
Thankyou for your assistance Cam.
Email with pics attached sent;42
The story of how I came by my L88 is'nt riveting reading really. It's pretty much the same as how most members here came by their corvette's. I will try and post something shortly.
Wayne;42
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Nice pictures I just got from Wayne. Hmmmm, might keep them to myself. Although at the fear of death I better share them. ;39
Here ya go lads. They are all now in the MPG.
Click This To See Them (http://www.nswcorvettes.com.au/photo/albums/userpics/Thumbnail.jpg) (http://www.nswcorvettes.com.au/photo/thumbnails.php?album=114)
Enjoy. ;46
Wayne,
I'm sending you an e-mail with with your user name and password. Go into to your control panel, once logged into the Members Picture Gallery, and make any changes you see fit to your profile page.
Cam
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Originally posted by RubyZR1
Joe, I owe all here an apoligy for my poor choice of words in the above post.
The reason why I did'nt have my car NCRS Flight Judged at Sandown in Melbourne 2006, is because I am just plain lazy.
As previously stated, my car requires quite a few little odds and ends.
Although I did state I am not a trophy hunter, I believe if I am to submit it for Flight Judging by the NCRS I should present it as best as I am able....I guess I just contradicted myself Joe;-)
My car does not have its original tyres Joe. That's one of the "little odds and ends" I was referring to above.
FWIW Joe, it was me that had breakfast with you on the saturday morning prior to the NCRS festivities kicking off.
Do you still have your lovely red roadster?
Wayne;42
Wayne how could i possibly forget you mate!!! you dont owe me any apology, dont be silly.
Dont want highjack this thread,but my 72 has gone your way,melbourne Geelong.
I am officialy looking for 69 big block possibly tri-power because by the way the market is going in the US, these cars are getting more expensive day after day!!!
I am actively looking so if i see any1 selling original tyres,i will buzz ya if your are intrested
cheers
back to your L88
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There's a saying that goes something like..."it's marvellous what a difference a year makes".
My L88 story goes back to circa 2001/02.
I found an internet website about a guy from Arizona who owned many nice corvettes inc. 65 roadster, 78 pace car, 93 40th Anniversary ZR1 (same as mine....that's why I emailed him) and a LeMans Blue/blk 69 L88 Coupe.
We exchanged numerous emails over time and in June 2003 he offered to sell me his 33000 mile LeMans Blue 69 L88.It was one of the 16 or so with the very rare M40 automatic transmissions. IMHO that blue is the prettiest colour, and with the factory fitted side pipes, it's one of the sexiest corvettes I'd ever seen.
Usual problem, I simply could'nt afford to buy it. The business I am involved with had endured extremely difficult financial times, and having just gone into debt up to my limit in March 2003, no matter how hard I tried, I just could'nt gather up the cash required. His asking price at the time was indeed more than reasonable, and is a gift when compared to today's prices.
During this time I also met other guys who were in the L88 scene in the USA via the internet. One owned a 69 Fathom Green/Blk L88, that he had restored and was having flight judged via NCRS. His L88 would go on to receive the "Duntov Marque of Excellence Award" and was also inducted into the "NCRS Hall of Fame". This guy was a commercial airline pilot, and was very helpful to me in my L88 quest.
In Feb/Mar'04 I mentioned I was interested in buying a 1969 L88, and would he assist me. He put me in contact with an NCRS judge (a Mr.Chuck Berge...I'm not usually a name dropper) who was reputed to be one of the most knowledgable on 69 L88's in the USA ,to represent me.
I wanted to have as many options as possible and had heard about that 69 Cortez Silver L88 here in Oz from friends in the local corvette scene.
I tracked down the owner and called him circa Feb/Mar 04 and asked him to sell me his 69 L88. His initial reply was that "it was not for sale, and that ironically another guy from Sydney had recently called him asking the same question".
I had'nt mentioned money to the owner, and brazenly asked how much the guy in Sydney had offered him for his 69 L88. When the owner told me the amount, well let's just say it was way more than I had anticipated.
The owner said he was coming to the annual corvette convention in melbourne and we agreed to meet there.
The 2004 convention came and went, not without its hiccups. Being the first and only corvette convention I have been to, I've got to say I had a blast. Congrat's to the unsung heroes for their efforts; and to the people who supported it by attending with their corvettes from all model years and condition.
I met with the L88's owner as planned. He answered my every question about his 69 L88, and about his L88 ownership experience. I could'nt muster the courage to ask him again to sell me his L88, because I could'nt afford the price offered by the Sydney guy; and I would'nt embarass myself or insult him with a lowball offer.
My 81 Corvette I took to the convention sold in May'04. I now had room in my small garage for an L88...things were finally falling into place.
Later that month I received a call from the Silver L88's owner advising me I could buy his L88. I could'nt then afford his asking price and had to respectfully decline his generous offer, as much as that hurt me to do.
During Feb, Mar, April & May the US NCRS judge emailed me details of a few 69 L88's for sale. By the time we got to say "yay" or "nay", they were all sold. These 69 L88's are very highly sought after cars in the USA. I was starting to wonder whether I would get one.
I received an email for a red/blk/white 69 L88 roadster with colour matching hard top. It was an "older restoration" having been restored by the famed Nabours Bros. back in 1988. It had scored "Gold" at Bloomington Gold in 1988.
The US NCRS judge inspected the L88 in Canada for me.
This L88 did not have its original L88 engine block(which was an issue for me). The OEM L88 was grenaded with only about 1000 miles on it buy the first owner. Luckily for the owner, he was able to get a correct date coded block for his L88. The re-stamped engine pad was professionaly done and passed inspection by the NCRS. The reason this L88 was for sale was simply that its owner collected Mopars and Hemi Cudas, and apparently b/n him and his father had one of the best Mopar/Hemi collections. I was told back then by the NCRS judge that a rare Hemi Cuda convertible would bring $2 Million US.....that's some serious cash indeed.
This red L88 roadster had part of its original tank sticker. They could'nt remove it intact from the tank, so they cut the OEM gas tank up to retrieve it, and put another gas tank in it.
This 69 L88 had also had many well known corvette collector owners' throughout its life. Ironically, one of those corvette collectors a guy named Dr Donald Amerson, had also owned the Green 69 L88 I eventually bought.
I was procrastinating the purchase of this red L88. My corvette friends were keen for me to buy this L88 roadster, as it would be quite a contrast to the silver coupe already in Oz.
I was troubled by the non-OEM engine issue with this 69 L88 (being annally retentive and all), and I really wanted the N14 option of the factory fitted side pipes. Although less than 10% of all 69 corvettes have this option, if I were to have a 69 L88, I wanted one with the factory side pipes....which further limited my selection from the 116 L88's produced by GM. No-one knows for certain how many 69 L88's have the N14 option, some say as few as 12 in total.
It seemed I would go L88-less until late May 04 I received an email from the guy in Arizona (who owned the 69 LeMans Blue L88) asking me if I was still in the market for a 69 L88?
There was a Green 69 L88 for sale by a dealer in Toronto, Canada (Legendary Motorcar Company), was I interested???
I rang the US NCRS judge and enquired about this car. It turns out, that after inspecting the red roadster for me in Toronto, he had a few hours to kill before his flight home departed, so he called by to inspect this 69 L88. He said to me it was the "real-deal" and although needed restoring, had the most comprehensive documentation set he had ever seen for a 69 L88.....PLUS, it had the much desired N14 option, the factory fitted side pipes I lusted after.
The decision was made then and there that if this L88 was available, I would buy it.
Because Canada was approx 14 hours behind Oz in time, I had to wait until 10.30 P.M. that night our time before I could telephone the dealer (LMC).
I made the call and the dealership did'nt beleive me at first when I told them I was calling from Australia. I was put through to the salesman handling this car and was advised by the salesman (a guy named David Griffiths, who turned out to be a stand-up guy throughout the entire process) that a potential buyer had already placed a refundable deposit of $10,000US down for the car and was flying in that afternoon to inspect the car.
I don't need to tell you how I felt upon hearing that news. Never the less, I enquired whether there were any other interested persons in this car. David replied he'd love $1 dollar for every phone call he was getting on this car.
I asked David whether anybody had asked to be put in the que, if this sale fell through....he said no!
I asked him whether he would be prepared to give me the second right of refusal for this 69 L88, if for what ever reason the sale fell through....he agreed.
However, the first owner, having paid a substantial deposit for this 69 L88 was awaiting a property settlement to provide the balance of the purchase price. David agreed to give him two weeks, which is what the first purchaser demanded. David advised me if the first purchaser fails to finalise the deal in the next 14 days as agreed, then his deposit would be refunded in full, and I would be offered the car.
Waiting that 14 days was like an eternity. I could'nt stop myself thinking about this car. I found myself becoming irritable, had difficulty sleeping; endless thoughts of this car were starting to take over my life...damn...I never expected this.
Anyway, the 14 days were up, and I made the call to LMC 10.30 P.M. on the designated evening. I was eventually put through to David Griffiths,expecting the worst I asked "is it for sale?" David replied, "Yes...would you like to buy it?" I could hardly believe my ears, I asked him"what happened?"
David explained there were unexpected issues with the first purchasers' property settlement and he requested an extension of the time to raise the neccessary funds to finalise the deal with LMC. David explained to the first purchaser their contract stipulated that settlement would be finalised within 14 days, after which; the initial deposit would be refunded and the deal terminated with the first purchaser.
Long story short (if that's not an oxymoron), I bought that 69 L88 from LMC in June 04. There were a few tears of joy shed after that phone call, I don't mind admitting.
I had the L88's documents Fed-Ex'd immediatley, and the car was shipped to LA for its journey across the pond to Oz. It arrived in Oz in Oct'04 and I had Peter Whiston at Corvette Clinic in Melbourne (that's where the under car pics originated from..thanks to Peter) give it a once over before flat-bedding it to its new home.
The options are all listed on the Corvette Order Copy.
For the uninitiated (no offence intended here guys) who are unsure, the "2L88 Special Turbo Jet 427" is the key option, hence the reference to the code "L88".
My L88 has a 4.11:1 rear gear set. Despite what magazine articles have written about L88's being contankerous and difficult to start and drive, my L88 starts up real easy. The sound of that BB lumping over is music to one's ears indeed. Talk about free rev, with its 6500 red line that 427 revs like nothing I've ever owned. Geez, I thought my 93 ZR1 was a screemer, its nothing compared to the 427 L88.
A downside (is there one, you might wonder!) is the L88 requires very high octane leaded fuel (103 Minimum as stated on the warning label attached to the centre console) ie Av-Gas. Early 69 L88's like mine have a 12.5:1 combustion ratio, which changed around May/Jun'69 to 12.0:1.
The only legal way I can purchase Av-Gas was to join a local car club, obtain a CAMS 2LS licence and obtain a Leaded Fuel Passbook. Av-Gas was over $2.50/litre the last drums I purchased. Seems I'll have to befriend a person who owns a plane or an airfield to guarantee future Av-Gas supplies because a former Federal Government report was intending to outlaw its use with the exception of the Aviation industry from Dec'05. Thankfully, this legislation has'nt been enacted as yet!
Also, the VIN only appears on the Car Shipper Copy and the Moroney report. It does'nt appear on the Corvette Order Copy (Build Sheet or Tank Sticker).
If you look closely at the top of all three documents you will notice the alpha-numeric code "AYL-135". This code links all three documents in this set. I do not know what relevance this code has in the overall scheme of things as far as GM is concerned. Maybe someone here can chime in with their thoughts on same.
You will also notice the "69" written in pen by an assembly line worker on the Corvette Order Copy. Those are the last two digits of its VIN.
That pretty much outlines my 69 L88's story so far. If you've read this far, I thank you and hope you were'nt bored out of your collective wits.
I'm still very keen to complete the gaps in my L88's ownership history, so that when I pass it on to its next custodian, that will be one less task to be completed. As you all know, as time passes by; so do we.
Hopefully Cam can assist to upload the pics of this L88.
;42
Wayne
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you can get tyres from coker in the states or vintage tyres in victoria,they are remakes of the originals and joe may be able to tell you if the ncrs judges recognise them or not for the points?
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Have split this thread from the original E'bay thread and Pinned it to the top of the list for safe keeping. Also copied to the Storage area
Cam
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Wayne,
THANKYOU,THANKYOU,THANKYOU i loved that article you wrote and the pixs you posted i hope to see this car one day as i am as obsessed with the L88 as it seems you are .
cheers boschvette
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Thanks for sharing your story. It's a great read!
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Simply Awesome !! Proves that dreams can come true.;42
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Wayne
Thats a real nice L88 , great colour i think , i owned a Red L88 Ragtop back in the states 89-90 something like that , i ended up selling it to a guy in Baltimore around 8months later , great car but i had too many and it was either sell the 69-L88 or my L71 Auto (Rare)which i bought off the 2nd owner my girfriends dad , and it was a real gem never played with & i had every bit of paperwork finance papers , Protecto etc,etc i ended up bringing that car and another 435car back to Australia , the 69auto ended up being totalled by a young kid in WA ,it was my favourate
That silver car you mentioned was owned by a mate of mine in Canberra , i could have bought it for around $80k 12 or so years ago , the guy in Cairns ended up with it i remeber going to see him a few years back , while i was up there buying some tripower bits he wants some rediculous price , if i remember
And buy the way their was another L88 here years ago ,
a guy rang me up when i was bringing in some vettes , he said he had a motor out of a vette which he yanked out of a car , he bought for his son
and it ran sh#tty so he swapped it out , i wasn,t really interested untill i asked him to give us some numbers and he said he scratched the alloy heads !, i ended up tracing the car to Tassie where it had hit a tree killed the owner , burnt down , you would be surprised whats sitting in peoples shed,s here
,
Enjoy driving it
Cheers
Cheers
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Are you back in NSW yet MR L71?
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Hi Andy
No i,m still up here in Jabiru , running the electrical mining dept at Ranger , ive still got the project , ive decided to sell the blown motor & go an LS2 or something , in the meantime i,m looking for something else to buy for up here, looking for another big block , my orange 69 is up for sale i might buy it back , at least its aircond and its got long legs , hows the RAT going
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only 590rwhp! I guess thats going good!;41