Author Topic: 76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle  (Read 11449 times)

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Offline Bfit

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« on: July 14, 2011, 12:58:26 PM »
Hi every one
I am hoping to get a bit of feed back on what problems  I mite  run in to fitting a LS3 in  to a C3
I am sure some one out there will have already done this

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Offline Scott

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2011, 02:44:00 PM »
I think the biggest problem is getting the correct sump and ancillaries. I never worked out if the local commondore ones are correct.  I'm pretty sure the sump is the wrong one and you'd need an aftermarket one.

There are engine mount plates that allow the engine to be mounted very easily. There are a few different designs that put the engine forward or higher/lower, but you don't want the sump too low. You have to work out the best comprimise.

With the gearbox, half of the problems mentioned previously still exist if you go the T56.  You'll need to cut/fab the cross member, shorten the tailshaft, convert the car to hydraulic clutch master and sort out the elec/mech speedo problem.  The shifter may need a little modification to get it to come up through the right place.

Using the 4 speed auto wiill solve the hyd clutch issue but I'm not 100% sure if there is enough room in the trans tunnel.  Tail shaft, speedo and cross member will still be an issue, as will fitting the shifter to the console.

Then there is the wiring.  Enougn places fo LSX conversions these days, so that shouldn't be too much problem to find someone to do it.  You can probably get a harness from the states that will get you most of the way there.

Lastly, to get it engineered you will need all the pollution gear from what ever year the donor car is. So, charcoal cannister, cat converters etc.  All that crap.

One grey area is if you use an after market block.  Since they aren't from a car of any particular year, you may not require any pollution gear apart from what the car is originally specced in. (ie no cats)  You'd have to investigate this further though as I haven't looked into that as much.

Offline Bfit

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2011, 03:11:20 PM »
I would be getting the engine out of the US from a contact I have
 it would come with  sump for the vette and accessories high mounted on the front

The engines are built out of new GM components
and come with all the pollution gear. I don't mind fitting all that.
Do my bit to reduce pollution, on this car anyway.

engineers are a worry as no two have the same ideas
at 6.2L its a bit more than an over bore  from a 5.7 but arguable when it comes to doing it
Engine is about 50KG lighter   the only thing they could complain about is HP
And that can be tuned down   to a few hundred if required.
 
 How is HP measured for rego now days
I have not looked in to it yet
  But Hp used to be worked out on piston diameter
Goes back to the old steam days
that may well have changed,  since I did any of this ( mmm over 30 years )
one would think the powers to be would like the lower emissions and better km/ L


mechanically its straight forward  bolting it in there will  be ease.
 things to work out
radiator size  
how to adapt the tachometer
which engineer to Use
learning something about computer controlled  petrol engine ?( may be this should be listed first )

 Bfit

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Offline Scott

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2011, 04:10:31 PM »
So would it be built from a GM or aftermarket block?  It may make a difference to the engineer.  As will using the factory computer vs aftermarket.

Aren't the engines fly by wire?  You may need a suitable accelerator pedal set-up too.

I thought the rules for engine swaps were based on displacement, not horsepower.  Having a separate chassis helps with this lots. What year car is it going into?

There are plenty of threads on the US forums about the conversions. While it's not a straight bolt in, it's not too hard.

Offline Bfit

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2011, 10:29:01 AM »
IF I do this It will be in to  79
 computer and wiring are Gm
I have to ask the question about the block
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Offline Bfit

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2011, 03:51:28 PM »
I have  bought a LS1 to  learn  about these engine
I guess I will find out all the pit falls  for here on

I have been told this conversion  it just to hard
to many issues  
Is that not a good reason  to do it
 and test  ones resolve and skills.

I will start posting photos as I work it out.
But first I have to work out how to post photos?
that might be hard !

Jethro I may have to ring you up and get the finer points ON posting photos
   
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Offline Bfit

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2011, 11:04:42 AM »
Has any one  seen any good ideas on where to place the ECM  in  a C3
I would like to fit inside the car
More that likely it will go in the LH  guard
Any ideas  
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Offline BOSCHVETTE

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2011, 08:11:36 AM »
I priced this conversion up about 2 years ago and thought without engine and gearbox included it would be about $15-$18k to do it properly there is alot more work in it then people think.
I dont believe its worth it.
New toy about to breath life and we will have a strangle hold on the leadfoot forever 850hp 1150kg Australian sports sedan series here we come.
Z06 sports sedan about to be semi retired.
Old C4 weapon now retired to the garage
450 RWHP WITH MORE TORQUE THAN MUNDINE
BUT IT LOOKS LIKE YOU HAVE BOUGHT A BAG OF ROCKS TO A GUN FIGHT.....

Offline wabco40

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2011, 01:46:27 PM »
Quote from: BOSCHVETTE link=topic=8633.msg1045941446#msg1045941446
I priced this conversion up about 2 years ago and thought without engine and gearbox included it would be about $15-$18k to do it properly there is alot more work in it then people think.
I dont believe its worth it.


$15-18 grand without engine/gearbox sounds a bit steep.
Is this doing it yourself or paying someone to do it?

Offline Bfit

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2011, 02:26:35 PM »
I have to admit is is time consuming
But then  I have  moved the engine several times
and now i have purchased three  different sumps.

 
 
If you were doing it  on hourly it may run out to be  expensive.

I first bought and engine and gear box   ( mistake )
it cost far to much to buy all the parts to install and finish the installation.

After  starting to job
I bought a  commodore complete  which is drivable   you get every  thing to do the job  for a Few K
this is the only way  to go

Not allowing for time I would expect $  will run in to about 5k to 7k
when you consider the cost  to Run a 350 SB   the LS1 will pay for it self  in reasonable time if the car is  driven regularly

last weekend I did 550k in my 79 and eat up  180$ in fuel.
I would expect  the LS1 which makes more HP to use  half that.

When I get to the finish I would be more the willing to pass on any info to any one wanting to do this conversion.

Thinking about  this
engine and 4l60E and a complete car
a few sumps, harness mods,  engine mount adapter plates that don't  do the job
the 7k is gone.
I also bought a 76 to trail fit is all into  before  I will fit to my 79 model
Getting out of control ?

as the saying goes
 NOTHING ventured nothing gained

Bfit



 
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Offline Jethro

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #10 on: November 09, 2011, 08:57:20 PM »
Bfit the VE Commy Wreck with 6 ltr is the way ta go and you might even be able to sell some of the pannel work off on ebay:bannana:

Offline Bfit

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76 its a little sad this is the trail vehicle
« Reply #11 on: November 09, 2011, 10:10:28 PM »
Hi jethro
I am not keen on the ls2 and 3 as sold here in Aus'
they dont come with cable throttle
For the first one I am doing    the LS1 is best  to learn on
you can buy a commodore  with under A 100K for less than the so called coversions sold by the wreackers
in fact under 3k if you  wait for the rite buy.

and with some luck the 76 I have will sell with the  LS1 and 4l60E  as well as the original engine and trany as project  to some one
If not I have some other ideas for it
Bfit



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