Unique Cars condition codes

[gillmoss]

Hi guys,
Sorry if this is in the wrong place but I'm new to this forum.
I've been interested in corvettes for a while now and just recently had the funds to buy one myself. I saw that in the April Edition of Unique Cars (Issue 310) it had an American Buyers Guide. I was wondering what you all thought of the prices they've given here.  I'm especially interested in 1960's corvettes so those are the prices I'll post but if you want to discuss the rest i'll be happy to post them as well.
(The conditions are either 1, 2 or 3 but there is no guide to what each number means so I'm a little confused about that)

Corvette 1955-62
Condition 3 - $28,000
Condition 2 - $57,000
Condition 1 - $85,000

Corvette Convertible 1963-67
Condition 3 - $32,000
Condition 2 - $60,000
Condition 1 - $85,000

Corvette 'Big Block' Convertible 1965-67
Condition 3 - $50,000
Condition 2 - $85,000
Condition 1 - $120,000

Corvette Convertible 1968-71
Condition 3 - $22,000
Condition 2 - $35,000
Condition 1 -  $57,000

Corvette 'Big Block' Convertible 1968-73
Condition 3 - $30,000
Condition 2 - $55,000
Condition 1 - $75,000

Corvette Coupe 1963-67
Condition 3 - $35,000
Condition 2 - $57,000
Condition 1 - $72,000

Corvette 'Big Block' Coupe 1965-67
Condition 3 - $50,000
Condition 2 - $78,000
Condition 1 - $110,000

Corvette Coupe 1968-72
Condition 3 - $19,000
Condition 2 - $37,500
Condition 1 - $48,000

Corvette 'Big Block' Coupe 1968-72
Condition 3 - $25,000
Condition 2 - $47,500
Condition 1 - $68,000


Could somebody at least shed some light on the 1-3 grading system? Is this a common system that is used or did Unique Cars just make this vague system up for this article? I'm also aware this may be a little vague with the years, as from what I've seen there is a big peak in prices on the 63 corvettes.
Thanks in Advanced

[demonx]

Usually - a lot of the guides are in accurate based on where they obtain their information.

I don't like to follow guides for this info - I'd rather window shop aroiund for a while and get a true sense of market rather than reading a false value.

For example - I've heard the red book guide has based their prices on what people tell the state road authorities - which is never true as no-one ever wants to pay full stamp duties.

There is the glass guide - which is used by most insurance companies. I cannot remember where they get their info but it's not always great either.

The Unique cars guide I'm not sure but I know the Just Cars guide is based on averages of what people have listed their cars for in that magazine. I'd assume the unique cars guide would be similar.

[gtc]

Could somebody at least shed some light on the 1-3 grading system? Is this a common system that is used or did Unique Cars just make this vague system up for this article?

A more common system is 1 to 6, such as this one:

http://www.firsttraderegistry.com/old_cars_price_guide.htm

... so that may give you an idea, however you'd have to contact Unique Cars and ask them for an exact explanation of their 1 to 3 rating system.

I'm also aware this may be a little vague with the years, as from what I've seen there is a big peak in prices on the 63 corvettes.

Top condition 1963 "split window" Vettes can fetch a premium. When you say "1960's Corvettes", you are spanning 3 generations: the last of the C1s, the whole of the C2s and the start of the C3s, and prices will vary because of rarity -- very few C1s, a few more C2s, and even more C3s.

Are you looking to buy in Australia or the USA? If Oz, then look in places like carsales.com to see what 's being asked here.

As for actual condition, the best idea is to look around yourself and form your own impression, preferably in association with somebody knowledgeable in the series of interest.

Finally, you might find this list of things to consider helpful in general:

http://nswcorvettes.com.au/forum/viewthread.php?tid=7618&goto=search&pid=1045937079

[VETTENUT]

Unique Cars issue 307 from Jan-Feb 2010  included a buyers' guide for "Aussie collector cars". Page 76 has an explanation of their 1-3 grading system. Hope this helps you on your way to 'Vette ownwership.

[VET-005]

Here is the explination on how cars are evalued in the US by independent inspection agencies. I am pritty sure Unique cars would have adopted a similar format

CONDITION CLASSES

Class One (Excellent):
Almost always a “body off” restoration, or an untouched, factory-perfect, piece that is very close to perfect. All components are either original or appear as new and are fully operational. This car is a top show winner and is not driven, but transported to shows by trailer. This car is almost “one of a kind”. This particular class of vehicle is very rare. The vehicle is completely detailed, including the engine compartment, interior trim, wiring, suspension, paint, and frame. Ideally, this vehicle has been judged with other vehicles in its class and achieved the highest point ratings.

Class Two (Very Good):
This car is well restored with an eye for detail. The interior and exterior show minimal wear, and it runs and rides smoothly. The car is driven very little (maybe 800 to 1,000 miles per year). This class is a slight grade below Class One. A Class Two has not been detailed to the extent that a Class One has been. This class (Class Two) has some evidence of use and wear, although not very much. It is considered “cherry” or “mint”. This vehicle might appear as a Class One until judged against one. It would not qualify as a 95, or better, “point” vehicle. (This class should have no rust on the undercarriage, not even surface rust.)

Class Three (Good):
This is a functional, drivable vehicle in good overall condition needing no, or only minor work. Most vehicles at car shows reflect this condition. This car is what is termed a “20 footer”. From 20 feet, it may look very good. Close inspection, however, would reveal some worn interior trim, and less than perfect paint (worn, and perhaps faded). You may even see some early evidence that surface rust is beginning in the body panels. This car is completely operational and is an “older restoration”. It is driven fairly often, runs great, and is enjoyed by its owner. It is probably a candidate for a full restoration. The undercarriage may display surface rust, and may be in need of detailing. Chrome and trim may exhibit limited pitting.

Class Four (Fair):
This type of car is a fun “driver” with a solid frame and is structurally sound. This car is in need of considerable work. It needs work in and out. Cosmetics, body, and mechanical components all need work, to some degree. It is not a serious collector candidate. Soft floors, isolated areas where rust has eaten through (but not structural), excessive use of Bondo, lots of pitted chrome, glass repairs are symptoms of this condition. Badly soiled headliners, badly soiled and ripped upholstery, rusted out trunks are also signs.

[gillmoss]

Hey, thanks everyone for your help
I was originally looking at buying a car from Australia but after getting a better idea of the prices I'm looking at importing now. I'm going to the US on unrelated business so it works out pretty good.
Just wanted to know if you guys could tell me of any traps I might fall into or any info I would need. All i know at the moment is its virtually impossible to do parallel imports of newer cars for resale but I don't think the Australian government monitors older cars as much?

Thanks again

[demonx]

As I'm pretty sure you'll already know there are different import laws in concern to the age of the vehicle.

Then once you have them here there are differences in the registration, ie:  a modern car has to be converted from left to right which can be very costly. An older 30+ yo car does not.

Also when you apply for the import approval make sure you class it as a car and not a parts car otherwise you'll never be able to register it in Australia.

Make sure when you purchase the car it comes with a title. That title must be with the car when it is shipped otherwise it will never get on the water.

Make sure you keep your paperwork above board. The govt does random checks and If this happens to you they will not release the car until you have provided all paperwork including purchase reciepts etc. I have had this happen and had to get bank statements etc to prove the purchase price etc.

Use a shipper you can trust and feel comfortable with. It's a stressfull time importing a car for the first time and you'll want peace of mind. It may not seem stressful at the start but once the "wait" kicks in - you'll know what I mean.

[gtc]

Just wanted to know if you guys could tell me of any traps I might fall into or any info I would need. All i know at the moment is its virtually impossible to do parallel imports of newer cars for resale but I don't think the Australian government monitors older cars as much?

Start here:

http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/roads/vehicle_regulation/bulletin/importing_vehicles/general/index.aspx

[gillmoss]

Thanks for all your help guys, I'm well on my way to getting my corvette.

On the off chance that anybody has used an inspection service in the U.S. could you please let me know who it was and how you found dealing with them?  

[gtc]

On the off chance that anybody has used an inspection service in the U.S. could you please let me know who it was and how you found dealing with them?  

I haven't, but I've spoken about this to a guy who has, and that service applied to California state inspections only. If you're interested in a California car, then I may be able to help you make the contact.

Additionally, there is quite a lot of knowledge and expertise about importing among the members of NCRS Australia:

http://www.ncrs.com.au/

[RHD.68.l89]

Make sure you don't get a modified vehicle. The DOI is making it very hard to get import approval for any vehicle that has been modified. And when I say modified I mean wide wheels, custom paint and up. The ASRF is campaining for a reversal of this decision as it affects the hot rodders as well.

[gillmoss]

Custom Paint? Seriously? What about restorations? Minor or Major if they fall in like with the original product?

[RHD.68.l89]

Yeah I know,this is the information passed to the Chev club in Vic by the ASRF.
Respray/Restoration is completely different to "custom" paint but I can't see the reason why they would refuse importation.
I think the reasoning behind it is something like " Modified vehicles can be unsafe therefore a vehicle that has been modified in any way will be refused"

[gtc]

From the Unique Cars website:

CONDITION 1

BODYWORK: Should be free of dents, rust or obvious repairs. Minor stone chips are permissible although major blemishes or mismatched paintwork is not. Bright work must be complete and basically undamaged.

INTERIOR: Seats should be covered in original-pattern material, free of rips or other damage. The floor covering must be complete, clean and correct material. The headlining should be clean and the dash - especially where timber or veneer used - free of cracks or discolouration.

ENGINE BAY: Should be clean with no discolouration due to water, oil or battery leaks. No engine or fuel system leaks. The correct engine or one which was optional to the model should be fitted. Original components are a must if the car is to be upgraded to 'concourse' standard.

UNDERBODY: No dents or damage to the underseal, exhaust system complete and undamaged, no oil leaks from the differential, transmission or shock absorbers. Suspension components should be in good order.

WHEELS/TYRES: Original wheels with correct hubcaps or after-market wheels in keeping with vehicle style and age should be fitted. Tyres need to be correct size and speed rating with at least 50% of original tread depth.

CONDITION 2

BODYWORK: No serious rust or large areas of body filler evident. Minor bubbling in non-structural areas is permissible. Paint should be good-quality but may show evidence of repairs, chips and scratches. Bright work should be generally good, although areas of dulled or scratched chrome are likely.

INTERIOR: Seats may have been recovered but should be in good general condition. If trim is original, areas of wear and broken stitching are likely. Floor-covering should be complete. Carpets and hood lining should preferably be in the original pattern. Cleaning may be required.

ENGINE BAY: Engine should be of original type although original motor is unlikely. No major fluid leaks or discolouration. Cleaning will be required.

UNDERBODY: No serious damage however scrapes and chipping likely. Minor oil leaks are common, exhaust should be complete and free from holes or burning around joints. Suspension components such as king-pins, ball joints and shock absorbers need to be in roadworthy condition.

WHEELS & TYRES: Wheels should be original or legal-size after-market units. Tyres should have legal tread depth.

CONDITION 3

BODYWORK: Moderate rust is inevitable, although chassis firewall and other structural areas should be sound. Minor body damage is common. Paint is likely to be faded with uneven colour. Body filler usually found in panels but unacceptable in structural areas. Bright work should be basically complete and major components like the grille must be fitted. Re-chroming or polishing of most parts will be required.

INTERIOR: Seats need to be structurally sound but will normally need recovering. Floor coverings are likely to be damaged or missing. Door-trims should be fitted but may need replacement. Vinyl dash tops usually cracked or warped.

ENGINE BAY: Engine should run but work will be needed. Engine bay is likely to be dirty and oil-stained. Hoses and fuel lines may need replacement for vehicle to be reliable.

UNDERBODY: Will show signs of neglect and damage (dents, stone damage etc) but should be free of major rust. Chassis/structural members need to be straight. Suspension components and exhaust will usually need replacement.

WHEELS/TYRES: Wheels should be free of major damage, tyres will normally need replacement.

Vehicles which are in genuine 'concourse' condition will be in completely original condition, or the subjects of a total rebuild to the highest standards. In most cases they are better than when new. Some cleaning and replacement of minor components may be required, but anything more than minor blemishes will significantly reduce the car's chances of success. Cars with the potential to achieve the coveted 'Gold' standard, (90% or better), in open concourse judging can cost 50% more than 'Condition One' examples.