Author Topic: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017  (Read 25792 times)

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Offline Lefty

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #20 on: December 13, 2013, 06:24:43 AM »
Yes a current option

One possible option for the future,

Get your current ride modified to be more self sufficient, and instead of paying for petrol, oil etc, pay back the conversion debt?

Lefty
79 vette

Offline bfit

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #21 on: December 13, 2013, 11:31:21 AM »
All those Holden dealers will sell something that has a Holden badge on it

I don't see to many small business getting any hand outs  to stay open
If you get behind in your tax bills they will wind you  up  with out a thought
Remember the FN large hand out the US government gave GM a few years back
 11 billion as I remember it.
union officials are up in arms, BS I say
the Australian way is the screw the company on behalf of the works
the the federal government  want to screw all the business they can on behalf of who ? the own mismanagement
state Government want to screw every one they can to fill (whos ) pockets  ( more waste )

I am a little pessimistic about the intentions of those in power
I don't think I have seen a politician nor a union official  being evicted  due to lack of money

I am over them all
BFit
 
 


I have seen too many instances where people continue to pursue wrong courses of action because they do not take the time to think critically about what has happened in the past.’’
Winston Churchill

Offline StephenSLR

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #22 on: December 13, 2013, 02:41:36 PM »


s

Offline MY081

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #23 on: December 13, 2013, 02:41:49 PM »
I remember when we could buy an australian made radio and tv and fridge .I guess our kids will be able to say they they remember when we made terrific automobiles Unions are irrelivent ,Politicians have no integrity .

Offline StephenSLR

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #24 on: December 13, 2013, 02:46:10 PM »
I remember when we could buy an australian made radio, tv and fridge.
You could buy an oven and fridge made by Holden in fact.





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Offline MY081

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #25 on: December 13, 2013, 02:47:23 PM »
Dont blame Abbott i dont think the damage was done in the last few months !!!!


Offline StephenSLR

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #26 on: December 13, 2013, 02:52:45 PM »
Dont blame Abbott i dont think the damage was done in the last few months !!!!

The car industry has its problems but would the previous govt. have bailed them out again or push them out like this one did?

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Offline bfit

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #27 on: December 13, 2013, 03:45:55 PM »
What we should be looking at is Why
Can other countries make quality motor vehicles at twice the numbers per day or more that we can here
in australia.

its not all labours rate that is the problem.

Also
Is it possible that the fat cats the run these show have deep pockets and they are filling them with as much money as possible while the sun shines.
Bfit

mmmm a bit like politicians do,  some of whom are in the court system rite now
I have seen too many instances where people continue to pursue wrong courses of action because they do not take the time to think critically about what has happened in the past.’’
Winston Churchill

Offline StephenSLR

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #28 on: December 13, 2013, 03:48:28 PM »
Also, is it possible that the fat cats the run these show have deep pockets and they are filling them with as much money as possible while the sun shines.

Yes it is!

It'd be an eye opener to find out what the CEO's make each year.

s

Offline 69VETTE

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #29 on: December 14, 2013, 03:08:26 PM »

Personally,  its all the Govenments fault, past and present, but mostly present for fkin up the industries, and allowing the businesses to go overseas to china !

Eg: Pilkinton glass no longer makes quality, first class glass for Australian automobiles, causes its a sh#t load cheaper to import glass manufactures in china (where the is no EPA guidelines & labor is like paying peanuts), which is crap, flawed and has by far lesser quality than that made here to Australian Standards.

Holden now imports all glass from china!.. god help if you crack a windscreen in your car...

Anyway, its i blame Julia Gillard !!!!

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Offline coradict72

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #30 on: December 15, 2013, 07:06:14 AM »
Its still quite some time till 2017  Lets hope some clever ideas service during
this period.
I truly believe we should be the same as the UK and allow new car imports
as left hand drive sorry performax but some will still want the foolish conversion

Love to see the C7 here for under $120k LHD adding all import duties and ADR adjustments
Soon we will have a motorists party in nsw we can lobby.

For now a Holden ute looks like a collector for later..

Offline anychevy

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #31 on: December 15, 2013, 10:30:22 AM »
I truly believe we should be the same as the UK and allow new car imports
as left hand drive
You can fully register an old car that doesn't stop, or handle and has absolutely no safety features at all.
But you cant have a new LHD car, with every electronic driver aid imaginable, 30 air bags, crumple zones etc. etc.

Fair enough on a car which you can buy RHD, but on low volume imports, it doesn't make any sense at all !
You have to spend up to 50K having your car butchered, which is F-cking ridiculous.  :grr:

Offline coradict72

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #32 on: December 15, 2013, 11:05:50 AM »
Well said,

Bowling green plant wouldnt even consider making 12 new C7's for rhd to Australia
I can hear the laughter . :laugh:....


Offline bfit

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #34 on: December 16, 2013, 09:34:12 AM »
Stephen good article

That is reality in the business world.

The lucky county is now in the situation that we are heading to the time when we can not afford to feed our selfless.

The majority of good trades people are 40 plus and the younger generation are not exposed to the same experiences that the generation of the 50s/60s/70s were

The experience and expertise  our country thrived on, is dying out
where are we heading ?

Political bullsh#t is killing us
Our politicians need to grow some B__ls  and make real decisions

3 years of T Abbortts   BS is going to take some getting past
and what was all the negative S_t for,  just to get the job.
 F the country!

I don't think much of the previous government either.
and the greens
Well I cant go there as I would get banned.

our politicians  are  turning our system into the  Americans stile of crap   and look how there country runs.
Or is it running.
They are bankrupt and no one is prepared to stand up and say so.
their whole  system is living on borrowed time and  Money
17 trillion and counting
Bfit

I have seen too many instances where people continue to pursue wrong courses of action because they do not take the time to think critically about what has happened in the past.’’
Winston Churchill

Offline StephenSLR

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #35 on: December 16, 2013, 09:45:13 AM »
Our politicians need to grow some B__ls  and make real decisions

Get engineers to run the country, not accountants.

s

Offline 86er

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #36 on: December 16, 2013, 03:42:12 PM »
Holden Australia was taken over by General Motors USA, then Unions Australia
This has been in the pipeline for 8-9 years, guys don't kid yourself it only just happened
Vette blues

Offline coradict72

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #37 on: December 16, 2013, 09:19:09 PM »
seems today on the radio
that a group of enterprising individuals
forming a syndicate to purchase the holden plant as is
Even though this is hot wind.
but we should kiss the holden brand good bye
The ute fully optioned does feel a collector to go with the old collectables we grew up with


Offline StephenSLR

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Offline StephenSLR

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Re: General Motors announces it will close Holden Adelaide operations in 2017
« Reply #39 on: December 18, 2013, 10:55:31 AM »
Here is the full version of the link I posted above, just realised it was only available for a short time.

ONLY $150 million a year will save Holden? Rubbish. The Holden Enterprise Agreement is the document that has utterly sunk Holden's prospects. It defies belief that someone in the company isn't being held to account for it.

Holden's management masks a union culture beyond most people's comprehension. Employment costs spiralled way beyond community standards long ago. Neither "pay freezes" nor more money will save Holden, but getting the Fair Work Commission to dissolve the agreement and put all workers on the award wage might be a start.

In 1991, the pre-enterprise bargaining award wage of a Holden entry level process worker was $462.80 a week. In 1992, Holden began enterprise bargaining and now a worker at that same classification level has a base rate of $1194.50 a week, a 158 per cent increase, or a compound increase of 4.4 per cent year on year for 22 years. Right now, base wage rates for process workers in the Holden enterprise agreement are in the $60,000 to $80,000 per year range and in recent times, "hardship payments" of $3750 were given to each worker.

The modern award for such workers mandates base rates in the $37,000 to $42,000 range. This means that before we add any of the shift penalties, loadings, 26 allowances and the added cost of productivity restrictions, Holden begins each working day paying its workforce almost double what it should. After you add in the other employment costs, I estimate Holden's workforce costs it somewhere close to triple the amount it should.

Many people who work at Holden don't actually work for Holden; they work for the union. Occupational health and safety people are given 10 days' paid time off a year to be trained by the union. Most companies do not allow unions to train their OH&S people because the knowledge is used to control the workplace to the benefit of the union.

Union delegates are also allowed up to 10 paid days a year for union training in how to be effective union delegates and two of these delegates are entitled to an extra Holden sponsorship of one paid month off to "further their industrial and/or leadership development".

Holden's rules on hiring casuals are shocking and unheard of in today's market. The agreement forbids Holden from hiring casuals except when a "short-term increase in workload, or other unusual circumstances occurs". If this situation arises Holden has to "consult and reach agreement" with the union. Further, "Engagement of the agreed number of casual personnel will be for the agreed specified tasks and the agreed specified periods." If any of this changes, Holden must get union agreement again. After three months of continuous full-time work a casual must be made permanent. It is impossible to run a business like this.

An ex-employee from Adelaide, on condition of anonymity, consented to an interview yesterday. He described the workforce as "over-managed", with one team leader for every six workers on the production line, when one for every 25 workers would suffice.

He said "some of us workers felt it wasn't necessary to get paid what we were getting paid to do the jobs we were doing", adding that their work is probably worth about "20 bucks an hour". A few years back, mates took redundancy packages in the order of "$280k plus". Workers are "like sheep" that blindly follow the union leadership. At induction, new workers are ushered into one-on-one meetings with the union rep who heavies them into joining. "It is made clear that if you don't join the union you will be sacked," he said. Union representatives "don't actually do any work for Holden", but rather make themselves full-time enforcers of union control.

He says workers are drug tested before hiring, but "only have to stay off it for a few weeks, get in the door and then you'll be right". Workers caught taking drugs or being drug-affected at work are allegedly put on a fully paid rehabilitation program, with special paid time off of about four weeks duration, before being let back into the workforce.

Australian workplaces have a zero tolerance for drug use, with instant dismissal the remedy, but at Holden "the union won't let the company sack" any workers caught dealing, taking or being on drugs. "If they did a random drug test tomorrow they'd probably have to sack 40 per cent of the workforce," he adds.

If the Holden scenario were playing out in a privately owned business, proper cost-cutting strategies would be used. If you have the will and can hire the skill, there are many ways to cut labour costs. The workers can be given a couple of years notice of significant wage drops and can receive lump sum payouts of entitlements to help bring down family debt.

Of course, these strategies are only ever used by business people who have no one else to bail them out. It seems Holden would rather leave the country than dissolve its enterprise agreement. The union thinks members are better off jobless than on award wages. Holden's fate seems sealed.

If Holden does leave, workers will receive the most generous redundancy benefits around. Holden says leaving will cost $600m. Most of this will go to staff payouts. The fellow interviewed agrees with my calculation: the average production-line worker will walk away with a redundancy package of between $300k-500k.

s